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#1 2005-06-02 19:55:58

MathsIsFun
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Magic Squares

What is special about the numbers in this woodcut (made by Albrect Durer in 1514):

durer.jpg


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#2 2005-06-02 20:16:01

justlookingforthemoment
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Re: Magic Squares

Let me guess: they're the numbers from 1-16; [answer removed and Yes - You Are Right. MathsIsFun]!

Last edited by MathsIsFun (2005-06-02 20:28:39)

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#3 2005-06-16 05:59:26

Roraborealis
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Registered: 2005-03-17
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Re: Magic Squares

NO! I can't see some numbers!


School is practice for the future. Practice makes perfect. But - nobody's perfect, so why practice?

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#4 2005-06-16 09:49:46

MathsIsFun
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Re: Magic Squares

Top right, below the bell.


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#5 2005-06-16 18:44:47

Roraborealis
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Re: Magic Squares

Yes, I see them, I just can't make out what some of the numbers are, for instance the one above four.

Last edited by Roraborealis (2005-06-16 18:45:46)


School is practice for the future. Practice makes perfect. But - nobody's perfect, so why practice?

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#6 2005-06-16 20:19:25

justlookingforthemoment
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Re: Magic Squares

Sorry...did I spoil it for everyone else or did you remove it in time, MathsIsFun?

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#7 2005-06-16 22:23:38

MathsIsFun
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Re: Magic Squares

Not at all spoiled, justlooking, and anyway, you CAN solve them when you want!

Rora, I think the numbers are:

16    3     2   13
5    10   11     8
9      6     7   12
4    15   14     1

Why?


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#8 2005-06-16 22:30:57

justlookingforthemoment
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Re: Magic Squares

Phew!

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#9 2005-06-17 03:12:38

Roraborealis
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Re: Magic Squares

Is it because they all add up to 34 in each row?


School is practice for the future. Practice makes perfect. But - nobody's perfect, so why practice?

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#10 2005-06-17 11:19:44

MathsIsFun
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Re: Magic Squares

How about the columns? And diagonally as well?


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#11 2005-06-17 18:22:36

justlookingforthemoment
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Re: Magic Squares

They're magic!

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#12 2005-06-17 19:00:54

justlookingforthemoment
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Re: Magic Squares

MathsIsFun wrote:

Albrect Durer

Albrecht Dürer

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#13 2005-06-17 20:56:26

MathsIsFun
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Re: Magic Squares

Entschuldigung !


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#14 2005-06-17 23:34:17

stewie
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Registered: 2005-03-28
Posts: 820

Re: Magic Squares

MathsIsFun wrote:

Top right, below the bell.

I didn't know Zach was in the picture. big_smile


HAPPY HAPPY, JOY JOY  big_smile
cool Fatboy Slim is the band of the 90s, thats if you want to call it a band because its really a one man name cool

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#15 2005-06-18 16:40:26

akshaylovesmaths
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Registered: 2005-06-16
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Re: Magic Squares

16

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#16 2005-06-18 19:49:23

MathsIsFun
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Re: Magic Squares

Hi akshay, that is a most elegant number. It is 2^4 and also 4^2.


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#17 2005-06-18 20:32:16

Roraborealis
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Registered: 2005-03-17
Posts: 1,594

Re: Magic Squares

MathsIsFun wrote:

How about the columns? And diagonally as well?

I meant to say that, too.


School is practice for the future. Practice makes perfect. But - nobody's perfect, so why practice?

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#18 2005-06-18 22:28:26

MathsIsFun
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Re: Magic Squares

Shows how long (1514) people have had a fascination with the magic of numbers. It stretches back much further of course to the Greeks, Arabsm Chinese, etc. But this is a great example.

I think at the time, such arrangements of numbers had an almost magical significance. (Hence the name Magical Squares?)


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#19 2005-06-18 22:47:44

Mr T
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Registered: 2005-03-30
Posts: 1,012

Re: Magic Squares

stewie wrote:
MathsIsFun wrote:

Top right, below the bell.

I didn't know Zach was in the picture. big_smile

sophisticated humour there


I come back stronger than a powered-up Pac-Man big_smile
I bought a large popcorn @ the cinema the other day, it was pretty big...some might even say it was "large
cool Fatboy Slim is a Legend cool

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#20 2005-06-19 04:44:26

Roraborealis
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Registered: 2005-03-17
Posts: 1,594

Re: Magic Squares

Oh, why don't you just leave Zach alone? Do you have a problem with his existence?

Last edited by Roraborealis (2005-06-19 04:44:40)


School is practice for the future. Practice makes perfect. But - nobody's perfect, so why practice?

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#21 2005-06-19 05:28:03

Zach
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Registered: 2005-03-23
Posts: 2,075

Re: Magic Squares

It's a natural human response to be like this when you're intimidated by someone. big_smile


Boy let me tell you what:
I bet you didn't know it, but I'm a fiddle player too.
And if you'd care to take a dare, I'll make a bet with you.

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#22 2005-06-19 20:42:31

justlookingforthemoment
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Registered: 2005-05-26
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Re: Magic Squares

I think they're just jealous of people who speak English.

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#23 2005-06-22 08:47:12

Mr T
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Registered: 2005-03-30
Posts: 1,012

Re: Magic Squares

I am sensing a sense of hostility towards myself and stewie right now.


I come back stronger than a powered-up Pac-Man big_smile
I bought a large popcorn @ the cinema the other day, it was pretty big...some might even say it was "large
cool Fatboy Slim is a Legend cool

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#24 2005-06-22 10:49:05

MathsIsFun
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Registered: 2005-01-21
Posts: 7,555

Re: Magic Squares

Hostility? I hope not. I am thinking it is just light banter, or it gets deleted.


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#25 2005-06-30 20:35:25

justlookingforthemoment
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Registered: 2005-05-26
Posts: 2,161

Re: Magic Squares

With Rod's magic square above (I see that it's gone missing) any 2x2 group of numbers in a quare that you pick also adds up to 34.

Here is a 5x5 magic square:

17   14   6    3    25
8    5    22   19   11  
24   16   13   10    2   
15   7    4    21   18  
1    23   20   12    9

It is symmetrical around its centre square, which means if you pick any two numbers which are opposite, they will add up to twice the centre square.

Also, if you tiled a floor with the above magic square, you could select any 5x5 grid and it would still be magic.

Last edited by justlookingforthemoment (2005-06-30 20:41:24)

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