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#26 2006-12-26 03:56:55

LQ
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Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

Devanté wrote:

Stalemate: The player to move has no legal move and is not in check. This may be because the moves are physically blocked, or because they would expose a royal piece to check.

If brownies stale mate the other player, then perhaps the king becomes a snowman, what do you say?

Also, the chess could be called "brownie chess", or "snow chess". perhaps "snowman chess" or "santa claus chess", "santa chess", "claus chess", "hoho chess" or something else. I call it something like that.

Last edited by LQ (2006-12-26 13:53:03)


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#27 2006-12-26 05:39:49

Devantè
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Registered: 2006-07-14
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Re: Xmas-Chess

I agree with the king becoming a snowman. Christmas doesn't end until the 5th of January. smile

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#28 2006-12-26 05:42:52

LQ
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Re: Xmas-Chess

Merry christmas today, Devanté


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#29 2006-12-26 10:33:40

MathsIsFun
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Registered: 2005-01-21
Posts: 7,535

Re: Xmas-Chess

BTW, some months ago I started work on a chess program in Flash.

I got it to the stage where you can move the pieces on the board, but there is no computer opponent, and it is pretty "raw".

You can see how far I got here: http://www.mathsisfun.com/games/chess.html

(If you want to play chess, though, a current working version in javascript is here: http://www.mathsisfun.com/games/chess/index.php )

However it could be developed to allow games between people on the forum. (another project I don't have time for smile )

And someone could also change it to handle these Christmas rules. There is a year left till next XMas.


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#30 2006-12-26 11:44:29

LQ
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Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

Well, a simple way would be to mathematically define the AI move and make a simple java program that wrote the move of the AI next to that program you've got there and let the player move the AI's piece for it. You've got your normal chess then. And if you had a "knitted cap button" you could distribute such as you normaly would take equal piece with piece. The AI (that you have to design for christmas chess) would reveal his move in christmas chess to the fully, including knitted caps. This would be a funny, working first step. It would also, presumeably be good for the moral and for chess square reading, cause you would have to help the AI to move his piece right. When you've done your move, then simply reveal your move to the AI and click an "OK" or "Done" or "Update" button

You could presumeably make an "if click, then red color" button if that is simpler then the knitted hat. The AI will work independently. Or even simpler, extend the chess board with 32 (8*4) squares, that contains brownie equivalents. This could also be worked out neatly and is hardly impossible.

Last edited by LQ (2006-12-26 11:54:49)


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#31 2006-12-26 13:14:35

Patrick
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Registered: 2006-02-24
Posts: 1,005

Re: Xmas-Chess

LQ wrote:

Upphovsrättslagen? (use a swedish english dictionary)

It works like this: you are my friends, I play christmas chess, you play christmas chess, I came up with it and was the first to make the design, so eventually, not to say directly I get "upphovsrätt".

No need for a dictionary here, I'm Danish smile (It's "Opretslov" in Danish by the way, and Rod it is in fact "Copyright"). I think you've misunderstood it. It is, as you say, selfdeclaring, but it does not apply to ideas. I'll give an example: You say you've made the pieces already. Now, what the copyright does, is to ensure that I don't copy your pieces 1:1. By this I mean that I have the right to make a new game called "Taskespillet", make pieces accordingly, and then use the same rules you created.
Say you had actually produced a final game. Along with the game itself, was put a booklet with the rules. Now, I would not be allowed to copy the text itself, but it would be perfectly legal for me to write the same rules with different words.


"Okay, so if this is true, how can people make money off their products?" You might ask. Well, this is where patents come into the picture! You can actually own an idea. I'm not getting into wether I think this should be possible or not, but you can. An idea can be patented, and then you would be right. In that case I would not be able to just alter the words, since the idea would actually be more or less the same.


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#32 2006-12-26 13:42:17

LQ
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Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

Yeah, well if your so interested, why don't you try it?
My rules will still exist on this forum, and knitted caps are as good as expensless and like only used at christmas. When it comes down to it, the only value is credit. And it is mine. And It's not worth patenting. Since it costs 2000$. Not to mention demand cost popularity curve. And my rules are cheaper to buy, cause I decide the price. And I can since I've got copyright. And surely copyright applies to every important part of my text, and there is like no way that you can reformulate that simpler. And the copyright is like appliable to all languages.

Last edited by LQ (2006-12-26 14:31:24)


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#33 2006-12-26 15:02:08

MathsIsFun
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Posts: 7,535

Re: Xmas-Chess

Say you wrote a book about kids going to a magic school ... would that infringe/violate/whatever the Harry Potter copyright?

How close could you get before you do get in trouble?

The answer depends on who you are, I guess what


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#34 2006-12-27 01:30:17

LQ
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Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

And then ofcourse we've got the "you cannot patent santa" rule. You cannot patent neither the knitted cap, nor a figure with a knitted cap since they are as old as day, and it is not like you can patent something just because you put a knitted hat on it.

"I patent this computer with a knitted hat on it", "I patent my phone with a knitted hat on it". "I patent my chocolate box with a knitted hat on it"

But you can sure have copyright.


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#35 2006-12-27 02:01:02

rida
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Registered: 2006-09-25
Posts: 839

Re: Xmas-Chess

Devanté wrote:

Christmas doesn't end until the 5th of January. smile

That's the same time as my brother's birthday


Dreams don't come true, you gotta make them come true.

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#36 2006-12-27 02:18:18

LQ
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Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

MathsIsFun wrote:

Say you wrote a book about kids going to a magic school ... would that infringe/violate/whatever the Harry Potter copyright?

How close could you get before you do get in trouble?

The answer depends on who you are, I guess what

If it's the same school, characters, heroes and properties, then you're probably breaking copyright.

Unless you are harry potter... I don't know what happens then!

Sorry, the post I deleted didn't make sence.

How is that chess working out for you?

Last edited by LQ (2006-12-27 07:53:06)


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#37 2006-12-27 09:42:51

MathsIsFun
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Registered: 2005-01-21
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Re: Xmas-Chess

Well... I want to finish my "Math Trainer: Multiplication", ... then I want to work on a High Scores function for "Speed Math", then ... well, I have a list, and I am checking it twice. smile


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#38 2006-12-27 09:59:06

Devantè
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Registered: 2006-07-14
Posts: 6,400

Re: Xmas-Chess

Best to do the big things last. smile

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#39 2006-12-27 10:20:27

mathsyperson
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Registered: 2005-06-22
Posts: 4,900

Re: Xmas-Chess

Yes, and this thing sounds pretty big. I have no idea how you would program an AI that's even able to play this game, let alone intelligently.


Why did the vector cross the road?
It wanted to be normal.

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#40 2006-12-27 21:09:02

LQ
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Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

Sounds like the math I'm interested in, I'll see what I can do.

Basically, you describe every move in terms of q(a)x + pos(x) + p(a)y + pos(y) where q(a)x + pos(x) and p(a)y + pos(y) ≤ 8 AND ≥ 0, and .

q = [n*,0,0;2,1,0;0,0,n;n,0,n;1,0,1;0,0,n;2,1,0;n,0,0], pos(x) = [pe1;pe2;pe3;pe4;pe5;pe6;pe7;pe8], pos(y) = [pp1;pp2;pp3;pp4;pp5;pp6;pp7;pp8],
pos(y,x) = [pe1,pp1;pe2,pp2;pe3,pp3;pe4,pp4;pe5,pp5;pe6,pp6;pe7,pp7;pe8,pp8] (the unpaseable squares in normal chess)

* where n + pe1 = pe1(2)

I will continue on this some other time. It seems simple enough.

Please reply if you find errors or want to continue.

Last edited by LQ (2006-12-28 03:13:35)


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#41 2006-12-28 23:47:03

Patrick
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Registered: 2006-02-24
Posts: 1,005

Re: Xmas-Chess

LQ wrote:

Yeah, well if your so interested, why don't you try it?
My rules will still exist on this forum, and knitted caps are as good as expensless and like only used at christmas. When it comes down to it, the only value is credit. And it is mine. And It's not worth patenting. Since it costs 2000$. Not to mention demand cost popularity curve. And my rules are cheaper to buy, cause I decide the price. And I can since I've got copyright. And surely copyright applies to every important part of my text, and there is like no way that you can reformulate that simpler. And the copyright is like appliable to all languages.

Apparently you didn't understand it at all. First of all, I'm not that interrested in the game. Second of all, buying your rules wouldn't be cheaper, because I don't even have to. I could just use them, no problem. Copyright applies only to a finished product, not an idea.


MathsIsFun wrote:

Say you wrote a book about kids going to a magic school ... would that infringe/violate/whatever the Harry Potter copyright?

How close could you get before you do get in trouble?

Plagiarism can be treated as an infringement of copyright, but doesn't always.


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#42 2006-12-29 02:04:49

LQ
Real Member
Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

Patrick wrote:
LQ wrote:

Yeah, well if your so interested, why don't you try it?
My rules will still exist on this forum, and knitted caps are as good as expensless and like only used at christmas. When it comes down to it, the only value is credit. And it is mine. And It's not worth patenting. Since it costs 2000$. Not to mention demand cost popularity curve. And my rules are cheaper to buy, cause I decide the price. And I can since I've got copyright. And surely copyright applies to every important part of my text, and there is like no way that you can reformulate that simpler. And the copyright is like appliable to all languages.

Apparently you didn't understand it at all. First of all, I'm not that interrested in the game. Second of all, buying your rules wouldn't be cheaper, because I don't even have to. I could just use them, no problem. Copyright applies only to a finished product, not an idea.

Well, it is a finished product and an idea, isn't it?


I see clearly now, the universe have the black dots, Thus I am on my way of inventing this remedy...

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#43 2006-12-29 10:39:56

MathsIsFun
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Registered: 2005-01-21
Posts: 7,535

Re: Xmas-Chess

A "brute force" AI (which can be very successful if you have ample computing power) is for the AI to try every move, every response to every move, its response to that, etc.

After any series of moves, the AI evaluates the board and gives a score.

After searching and scoring like this, getting deeper and deeper, it can simply be terminated on time (10 seconds, 10 minutes, whatever) and it will then take the move that heads it in the direction of best score for it and least score for you.

So, all the AI needs to know is the rules of moves, and a way of evaluating the board position.


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

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#44 2006-12-30 03:11:17

LQ
Real Member
Registered: 2006-12-04
Posts: 1,281

Re: Xmas-Chess

Yes. But you can also make an AI that calculates the number of moves minus one it takes for the opponent to reach a certain square. You then callibrate the number of aditional squares you cover at a certain position with that player and compare them with, and then you simply multiply these numbers with eachother to get the inverse of the relative necessity to move or block or cover, and then you must callibrate if you gain on moving your piece to another position etc.

Last edited by LQ (2006-12-30 03:13:16)


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