Discussion about math, puzzles, games and fun. Useful symbols: ÷ × ½ √ ∞ ≠ ≤ ≥ ≈ ⇒ ± ∈ Δ θ ∴ ∑ ∫ π -¹ ² ³ °

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**eigenguy****Member**- Registered: 2014-03-18
- Posts: 78

ShivamS wrote:

Math is all of math. For physics, you need calculus, differential equations, real analysis, linear algebra. That's about it.

NOT EVEN CLOSE! bobbym is right. Physics goes deep, deep into many varied fields of mathematics. I was led into differential geometry to study both cosmology and particle physics problems. Indeed, significant parts of differential geometry were developed exactly to support the theory of relativity. And my dissertation was developed to support certain aspects of string theory.

Differential geometry requires topology and abstract algebra (arising out of linear algebra, but extending to some very esoteric groups). The abstract algebra in particular has a very strong impact on the physics. Essentially, the reason we have only a finite number of elementary particles is because of abstract algebra. Also, perhaps the strongest need for classifying all finite groups was the need for physicists to see if there were other groups out there that could be used to explain current observations, which would have then resulted in different physical theories.

"Having thus refreshed ourselves in the oasis of a proof, we now turn again into the desert of definitions." - Bröcker & Jänich

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

Sorry, I haven't gotten that far in physics yet. I only recently finished most of what they call Quantum Mechanics II here and began relativity. So far, calculus, multivariate (multivariable gives a spelling error...) calculus, vector calculus, differential equations, real analysis and linear algebra is the only mathematics we have used so far. I have heard that in the graduate level courses differential geometry, topology and some abstract algebra is required, but I am not that advanced yet.

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 86,228

I do not know if they have given up on it yet but physics took a weird turn when Dyson and Montgomery began to discuss GUT and found that there was a possible relationship between it and Riemann's.

**In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.Of course that result can be rigorously obtained, but who cares?Combinatorics is Algebra and Algebra is Combinatorics.**

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**PatternMan****Member**- Registered: 2014-03-08
- Posts: 174

If Physics doesn't give me a good enough mathematical background then there's no way I'm doing it as a single subject. I want to actually be able to understand the millenium prize problems.

"School conditions you to reject your own judgement and experiences. The facts are in the textbook. Memorize and follow the rules. What they don't tell you is the people that discovered the facts and wrote the textbooks are people like you and me."

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 86,228

Wasn't it the Sokolnikoff's, (husband and wife) who said everyone should learn math from a physicist? Because it we learned it from a mathematician we would be ruined for life!

They based that on this famous quote:

Albert Einstein wrote:

Since the mathematicians have invaded the theory of relativity,

I do not understand it myself anymore.

From my own experience, before the topologists got involved with chaos the programmers and computational guys ( like me ) were having a lot of fun with it. Then they came, reworded it in their own image and then no one but them could understand it anymore.

Which type of guys you choose to learn from, their thinking "will forever dominate your destiny, consume you it will...-Yoda"

Or my favorite viewpoint, "When all you have is a big hammer you will tend to view the world as a large nail..."

**In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.Of course that result can be rigorously obtained, but who cares?Combinatorics is Algebra and Algebra is Combinatorics.**

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

ShivamS wrote:

I don't know about others, but certainly not me! I can solve Sudoku or Rubik's Cube that fast like those high IQ people do - which is about the only thing it's useful for.

I meant can't, otherwise the post makes no sense.

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Solving the rubik's cube is not about IQ.

'And fun? If maths is fun, then getting a tooth extraction is fun. A viral infection is fun. Rabies shots are fun.'

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

Really? I had heard it does.

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Well, i often get praised because i carry a rubiks cube al the time with me

'And fun? If maths is fun, then getting a tooth extraction is fun. A viral infection is fun. Rabies shots are fun.'

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

I don't really like puzzles a lot, except something like KenKen.

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There are publicly known algorithms for the cube which I believe any average IQ people can use to solve within 1 and a half minutes upon sufficient practice.

I think the true high IQ guys are the people who designed the algorithms.

My personal best is 70 seconds.

What is KenKen?

EDIT: Here is what a speedcuber says:http://www.quora.com/Rubiks-Cube/Is-the … telligence

*Last edited by Agnishom (2014-04-27 03:57:14)*

'And fun? If maths is fun, then getting a tooth extraction is fun. A viral infection is fun. Rabies shots are fun.'

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

I haven't tried solving the cube too many times, so I'm not sure. But I think Sudoku solvers tend to have a fairly high IQ.

KenKen is a really nice math puzzle. You should try it.

You can play it online at:

kenken.com

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i cannot solve sudoku by hand. I never had the patience to explore them.

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

Same here. I can't spend more than 5 minutes on a puzzle unless it's a math problem.

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There is a lot of math or programming about sudoku

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

I meant doing it by hand.

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Can you give me an idea of how to write a cube sol er?

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

A Rubiks cube?

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Yeah

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**ShivamS****Member**- Registered: 2011-02-07
- Posts: 3,528

Trying to post...

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alokananda wrote:

Hmm

goodnight. I'll have to wake up by half past 5 tomorrow.

'God exists because Mathematics is consistent, and the devil exists because we cannot prove it'

'Humanity is still kept intact. It remains within.' -Alokananda

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**bobbym****Administrator**- From: Bumpkinland
- Registered: 2009-04-12
- Posts: 86,228

Get some rest.

**In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.Of course that result can be rigorously obtained, but who cares?Combinatorics is Algebra and Algebra is Combinatorics.**

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