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## #1 2009-10-30 22:28:56

samalia
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### Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

i realli need some help with this puzzle called RELATIVE PICTURE!!!!!!!!!!!!

it is driving my mum and I crazy

if anybody can help us understand it, even just a lil bit then that would be great

i am new on here, so don't realli know how this works but we'll see

xxx

## #2 2009-10-30 22:37:29

MathsIsFun

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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman

## #3 2009-10-30 22:56:43

samalia
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

that doesn't help me to understand the puzzle

samalia
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## #5 2009-10-31 02:25:21

goteamusa
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

Hmmm... seems to me that the picture is of himself. Not positive, but that is the best that I can come up with.  The solution says it is his son. I am not sure about that. However, if the picture was of the man himself, I think that fufills the requirements of the riddle?

Last edited by goteamusa (2009-10-31 02:29:34)

## #6 2009-10-31 04:20:55

samalia
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

see i thought that as well but the man says he is looking at his brothers and sisters, so how can that be ????
thanks anyway mum and i just didn't understand it

## #7 2009-10-31 05:01:20

bobbym

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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

Hi;

Look at the solution that MathslsFun provided he is looking at a picture of his son.

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.
All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

## #8 2009-10-31 05:50:29

mathsyperson
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

It's probably easier if you read it backwards. Think about who "my father's son" is, and the rest is easy.

Why did the vector cross the road?
It wanted to be normal.

## #9 2009-11-02 00:17:51

samalia
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

i did look at the solution, thats what didn't make sense!!!!!!!!!! mathsyperson thanks that does make sense i kinda understand

## #10 2011-08-19 11:23:52

LycanMaster
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

He is an only child (Brothers and sisters, I have none)
He says that it is his fathers son

With these, it states that the man in the picture is himself.

[Inflammatory comment removed by moderator.]

## #11 2011-08-19 13:14:20

bobbym

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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

Hi LycanMaster;

Welcome to the forum. I have heard those comments too. They provoke me to action, that is why they are said. Retaliation is as pointless as the first insult.

In mathematics, you don't understand things. You just get used to them.
I have the result, but I do not yet know how to get it.
All physicists, and a good many quite respectable mathematicians are contemptuous about proof.

## #12 2011-08-19 15:32:28

anandbrar
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

Hi samalia, goteamusa, LycanMaster;

Read the statement of the question slowly and carefully..break it down into simple logical parts.

The man says, "Brothers and sisters, I have none, but that man's father, is my father's son."

1. Brothers and sisters, I have none --- means that he is the only child of his parents.
2. but that man's father --- 'that' refers to the person in the portrait.
3. (but that man's father,) is my father's son --- now my father's son means he himself, since he is an only child right?. So he is 'that man's father'...and so 'that man' is his son!

Reply if you still have any doubt..and well said bobbym.

"widen your gaze... extend beyond the obvious..."

## #13 2011-08-20 08:52:45

LycanMaster
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

#### anandbrar wrote:

Hi samalia, goteamusa, LycanMaster;

Read the statement of the question slowly and carefully..break it down into simple logical parts.

The man says, "Brothers and sisters, I have none, but that man's father, is my father's son."

1. Brothers and sisters, I have none --- means that he is the only child of his parents.
2. but that man's father --- 'that' refers to the person in the portrait.
3. (but that man's father,) is my father's son --- now my father's son means he himself, since he is an only child right?. So he is 'that man's father'...and so 'that man' is his son!

Reply if you still have any doubt..and well said bobbym.

Think about this. You would say that [Depending if you are male or female] I am my father's son/daughter. So my father's son would mean he is speaking of himself being the son of his father. See what I was saying?

Last edited by LycanMaster (2011-08-20 09:05:39)

## #14 2011-09-02 02:48:31

ShivamS
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

A man on a park bench is looking at a small portrait. You ask him, "Who is that in the picture?"

The man says, "Brothers and sisters, I have none, but that man's father, is my father's son."

No brother or sisters.
Although the man in the picture's father is my father's son. His father's son is only himself, so the picture man is his child.

I have discovered a truly marvellous signature, which this margin is too narrow to contain. -Fermat
Give me a lever long enough and a fulcrum on which to place it, and I shall move the world. -Archimedes
Young man, in mathematics you don't understand things. You just get used to them. - Neumann

## #15 2011-09-02 04:37:38

anonimnystefy
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

"Brothers and sisters, I have none, but that man's father, is my father's son."

let us consider the part "but that man's father, is my father's son.":

let us reverse the order:

my father's son is that man's father

now my father's son is me so the above statement is the sam as:

'me' is that man's father

or grammatically correct:

i am that man's father

which means that 'that man' is my son.

The limit operator is just an excuse for doing something you know you can't.
“It's the subject that nobody knows anything about that we can all talk about!” ― Richard Feynman
“Taking a new step, uttering a new word, is what people fear most.” ― Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Crime and Punishment

## #16 2011-09-02 08:11:32

ShivamS
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

anoni, reversing the phrase makes perfect sense. but how would you know that you have to reverse it?

I have discovered a truly marvellous signature, which this margin is too narrow to contain. -Fermat
Give me a lever long enough and a fulcrum on which to place it, and I shall move the world. -Archimedes
Young man, in mathematics you don't understand things. You just get used to them. - Neumann

## #17 2011-09-02 09:54:25

anonimnystefy
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

hi Shiva

please don't call me anoni.it sounds kinda stupid.

The limit operator is just an excuse for doing something you know you can't.
“It's the subject that nobody knows anything about that we can all talk about!” ― Richard Feynman
“Taking a new step, uttering a new word, is what people fear most.” ― Fyodor Dostoyevsky, Crime and Punishment

## #18 2011-09-04 22:19:16

GWMorris
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### Re: Grrrr !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Help A.s.a.p

Why would anyone think that you have to "know" to reverse it? You don't! He says "That man's father is MY father's son. We already know he has no brothers or sisters (and how the O.P got that the picture WAS of brothers and sisters, I don't know!), so HIS father's son has to be himself. Get it? There's no need to actually reverse it, it still means the same thing. Like "Who is that man's father? I am, and I'm an only child!" Just a bizarre way of saying that. I've encountered dozens of these over the years, some pretty far-fetched sounding and near impossible to figure out due to the confusion, but this one IS pretty straightforward.

Thinking of it in "reverse" just makes it easier to figure out/understand, you don't actually HAVE to, and besides anyone who knows math well can think that out logically anyway, especially if they ever did any computer programming!