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#1 2005-08-09 23:49:41

NIH
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A Diophantine problem

Find all integer solutions of a(a + 1) = b(b + 2).


2 + 2 = 5, for large values of 2.
 

#2 2005-08-10 07:52:23

MathsIsFun
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Re: A Diophantine problem

Let's try an example. How about finding b for a=1:

a(a + 1) = b(b + 2)
1(1+1) = b(b+2)
2 = b+2b 

So, let's try see if we can find a b that solves it:

b=1: b+2b = 1+2 = 3
b=0: b+2b = 0
b=-1: b+2b = (-1)-2 = -1
b=-2: b+2b = (-2)-4 = 0
b=-3: b+2b = (-3)-6 = 3   ... oops, went straight past it

Time for thinking cap ...


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman
 

#3 2005-08-10 09:25:22

kylekatarn
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Re: A Diophantine problem

integer equations!
these one's are always a challenge=P

 

#4 2005-08-10 10:52:35

kylekatarn
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Re: A Diophantine problem

a=0 b=0
until now I have only found the solution a=0 and b=0
probably there aren't more solutions

 

#5 2005-08-10 15:56:50

MathsIsFun
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Re: A Diophantine problem

Is it possible to use an odds and evens approach ?

If a is odd then a(a+1) will be oddeven = even
If a is even then a(a+1) will be evenodd = even

If b is odd then b(b+2) will be oddodd = odd
If b is even then b(b+2) will be eveneven = even

Ooops ... gotta go ...


"The physicists defer only to mathematicians, and the mathematicians defer only to God ..."  - Leon M. Lederman
 

#6 2005-08-10 16:32:35

ganesh
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Re: A Diophantine problem

Thanks, MathsisFun.
I'll continue from where you left.
a(a+1) is certainly even.
b(b+2) is odd if b is odd.
If b is even, b(b+2) is even, and is always a multiple of 4.
a(a+1) is a multiple of 4 only if a is multiple of 4 or it is a number of the form 4n+3.
Lets assume a is a number of the form 4n+3.
a(a+1) = (4n+3)(4n+4) = 16n + 16n + 12n + 12 = 16n + 28n + 12
= 4(4n+7n+3)
Let this number be equal to b(b+2)
b(b+2) = 4(4n+7n+3)
b + 2b - 4(4n+7n+3) = 0
b = [-2 √{4 +16(4n+7n+3)}]/4
Let n=0, we get an irrational number as b.
Let n=1, we get an irrational number as b.
Let n=2, again, we get an irrational number as b.

Can {4 +16(4n+7n+3)} never be a perfect square?

Is it because the last digit of {4 +16(4n+7n+3)} is 2 or 8 and not 4 or 6?

Last edited by ganesh (2005-08-10 16:35:20)


Character is who you are when no one is looking.
 

#7 2005-08-10 19:10:33

mathsyperson
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Re: A Diophantine problem

There are no squares that end in 2 or 8, so if 4 +16(4n+7n+3) always ends in 2 or 8, then we have a proof.
Take away 4: 16(4n+7n+3)=...8 or 4. Multiples of 16 move in cycles of 5, with the last digit being 6, 2, 8, 4, 0...
This means that 4n+7n+3 has to always be of the form 5m+3 or 4. So how do we show that?


Why did the vector cross the road?
It wanted to be normal.
 

#8 2005-08-10 19:11:49

wcy
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Re: A Diophantine problem

is it possible to use some general method as outlined by Euclid

 

#9 2005-08-11 09:11:35

NIH
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Re: A Diophantine problem

mathsyperson wrote:

There are no squares that end in 2 or 8, so if 4 + 16(4n+7n+3) always ends in 2 or 8, then we have a proof.

But if n = 3 or 4 (mod 5), then 4 + 16(4n+7n+3) ends in 4.

Here's a hint: add 1 to both sides of the original equation.


2 + 2 = 5, for large values of 2.
 

#10 2005-08-11 10:19:18

wcy
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Re: A Diophantine problem

then,
RHS=b+2b+1= (b+1)

but what abt LHS ?

Last edited by wcy (2005-08-11 10:42:04)

 

#11 2005-08-11 10:39:23

NIH
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Re: A Diophantine problem

wcy wrote:

but what abt LHS ?

Then the LHS equals a + a + 1. 

For what values of a can this be a perfect square?


2 + 2 = 5, for large values of 2.
 

#12 2005-08-11 10:47:38

wcy
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Re: A Diophantine problem

a can only be 0

 

#13 2005-08-11 10:50:55

NIH
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Re: A Diophantine problem

wcy wrote:

a can only be 0

Or -1.

If you can show why those are the only two values, the problem is solved!


2 + 2 = 5, for large values of 2.
 

#14 2005-08-16 10:27:33

NIH
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Re: A Diophantine problem

Here is a solution to this one.

a(a + 1) = b(b + 2) <=> a + a + 1 = (b + 1).
For positive a, a < a + a + 1 < (a + 1), implying there is a perfect square between consecutive squares; contradiction.

For negative a, a(a + 1) = p(p - 1), where p = -a, so there are no solutions for p - 1 > 0; i.e., a < -1.

It is then easy to check for solutions with a = -1, 0.
These are: (a,b) = (-1,-2), (-1,0), (0,-2), (0,0).


2 + 2 = 5, for large values of 2.
 

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